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Engine Buildups in progress Tell us what your latest project is, and post a few pics.

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Old 07-03-17, 05:19PM   #1
rexs73gto
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Default My 455, 469 build up.

As I had said a while back I got my block back & 2 nights ago & started to install the pistons in it. I put the crank in it about a month ago. As you can see I'm not in a big hurry as it won't be going in the car until this fall after the driving season here in MI. Well I got 4 in on the left side with no problem at all. I started to put the pistons in the right side last night & got 2, 4 , & 8 in but I had a problem with 6. My piston cup is getting old & the coating is waring off so the pistons started to slide a bit harder. When I tried to put #6 in it caught on the 2nd ring & bent it up a bit while trying to go in. When I pulled it out both top rings were damaged & the piston cup , well the coating had come off from use & wouldn't let it slide in any more. So I called Butlers today & got another set of rings for that piston. OH, I forgot to say I used a different ring compressor to install #8. I used my old band clamp unit which worked good & #8 went in easy. I may buy another piston cup , but not until I need it for another engine. The band clamp works good it just takes longer to use. This engine is a 455 + .60 over & I will use the RA IV Alum E-Heads for it that are on my 413 (400 + .60 over) now. I may reuse the cam that I have in the car now as it works great for me. It to is a Crane Blueprint RA IV cam & I have used this cam, not this same cam but the same style for the last 4 engines I've put together & it has been a great cam for my builds over the years. I know some think this is an old cam profile & there may be some that seem to work better for some but I love this cam & it makes good power. I don't know the exact HP numbers but I'm going to guess that it's in the 435 to 465 HP which pulls the car down the road very well. In 1st gear it will break the tires loose anything after about 2000 rpms & the same in 2nd gear. The car went 12:90's at the track & for a street engine thats pretty good. The new engine should be somewhere in the 550 to 575 HP rating. I'll know more after it's built. I'll get it on the dyno this time ,,,, if I can afford it. If not well I know it's going to be strong. The ring pack will be here some time this week & I'll get it in then. I have most all the part to finish but It's going to take all summer to build. I'll keep all informed.
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Old 07-03-17, 07:46PM   #2
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The 400 cam might not be big enough for the 469. You might want to save for a better cam. easy to do it while it is apart. Since your not in a hurry I would do some research. I do not want to start another cam debate here! LOL
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Old 07-03-17, 08:13PM   #3
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I agree on the cam choice. I get it..you like the cam, but hate to see you disappointed after all time and money you spent. A couple of things about the E-head vs a iron head. It likes more cam, and because it's aluminum head it dissipate the heat quicker. ( maybe not the right choice of words ) on my analogy of two heads iron vs aluminum. But you do need to run at least a point more compression then a iron head.

Being under camed and low on compression can be very disappointing in how much actual hp you make. Save the money and get the right cam. Sounds like a really nice street motor build. My brother has a 73 GTO too.
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Old 07-03-17, 08:48PM   #4
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Something Joe Sherman told me years ago,the better the head is the less cam you will need for a target HP.The target he has will take some pretty good flowing heads and I think a cam to the Flo of the heads.I don't see anything about Flo numbers or CR.Tom
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Old 07-03-17, 09:56PM   #5
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I think of it this way...what did the iron D-port heads flow 175-185. Like Ram air 3 cams, don't have the spec's off top of my head, so what was the difference in Ram 1V heads they flow 220 CFM

So what cam changes did they make between Ram 3 cam and Ram 4, more duration and more lift, why because the 4 heads flow more.

Take a E-head, they flow 270-280 CFM out of the box. What's the deciding factor cross sectional area. If the CSA doesn't match the piston speed it's not going to fill the cylinders as well

The iron heads had good low lift flow, and CSA matched the piston speed. Which is basically the rpm range.

Iron d-port heads were what 5500 rpm heads and Ran 4 6200. I'll bet the low lift flow of the E-heads are much better then both iron heads. So you need to take advantage of that.
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Old 07-04-17, 01:10PM   #6
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I don't think you would see much over 500hp with that cam.

To get a true 550 to 575hp I would have the e heads set up to handle a hyd roller cam in the 235/245 range and over 600 gross lift.
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Old 07-04-17, 01:13PM   #7
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290 CFM,10.25 CR,245-252@50 660 lift Hyd roller will get you in the 575 range with 455.Tom
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Old 07-04-17, 01:19PM   #8
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Quote:
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290 CFM,10.25 CR,245-252@50 660 lift Hyd roller will get you in the 575 range with 455.Tom
X2
Similar to my old setup 290cfm 10.25 compression 235/246 650 lift hyd roller,idled at 850rpm,pump gas...low 11's best of 10.95 at 123mph 3700lbs 3.08 gear

New build 315 to 320 cfm,11 to 1,235/246 680 lift,estimate 615 to 620hp,pump gas
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Old 07-05-17, 01:07AM   #9
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I ran this cam in my 462 engine with the RA IV alum. E-heads & it ran only what I can say was GREAT. Being a 455 + .30 over it ran like a raped ape. It ran very very strong & I can say even the gas mileage was better then what I get with this .60 over 400 thats in the car now. The car runs good with this cam & the E-heads now, I went 12:94 in the 1/4 with it. I think thats good for a street car with street radials on it. Other then going to a roller cam as I don't have the money for that which cam would be better for this engine combo? I will be doing some small port work just to clean them up (on the heads) so they will flow a bit better , but I'm not going all out because I don't want to start breaking things on the car. Give me some good options, I want to be able to start & run it any time which is the way it is now but I want to use my new engine to. Some time in the future I will be changing the rear gears to a bit lower gear to. I have 3:73's now & I think I'm going to go back to 3:08's so I can drive it more on the open road.
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Old 07-05-17, 01:15AM   #10
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Run what you have but your not going to get the 550-575 HP without spending money.Its very simple speed cost money,how fast to you want to go.Tom
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Old 07-05-17, 03:42AM   #11
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Did realize you had aluminum heads on a 462, so yeah if you went 12.70 and was real happy with that by all means use it. Do you know what the spec's of the cam is ?
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Old 07-06-17, 12:55AM   #12
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I don't have the exact cam specs but I know the gross lift with the 1:65 rockers , it's 520 lift, but don't remember the duration. I think it was 235/ 239 as it is a duel pattern cam. It is designed as a copy of the RA IV cam with a few tweaks being a duel pattern cam. I know by todays std. thats not a lot of lift but even with the Alum. heads which are designed like the round port RA IV heads it runs very good. By the way it went 12:90's not 12:70's , But they seem to work good with this cam on the 400 + .60 over. With these heads on the engine when it was a 455 + .30 or the 462, it went 11:77 at 122 mph. That was with street radials 3:73 rear gears M22 4 spd. & RA IV exhaust manifolds. Thats why I don't see just going to a .60 over 455 should be much difference. Comp. is at 10.1 on the 400, & I don't know but should be close to that on the 455/469. Am I wrong in thinking that ? I'm not trying to get every last HP out of it as this is a street car 99% of the time, & mat see the track 1 or 2 times just to see how fast it really is. Ideas ? Comments ? Help ? I have spent a good deal of money on the bottom end so I don't have problems with that because I don't want it to come apart if I do get down on it hard. I do drive it like it is ment to be driven, after all it is a GTO.
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Old 07-06-17, 03:48AM   #13
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Quote:
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I don't have the exact cam specs but I know the gross lift with the 1:65 rockers , it's 520 lift, but don't remember the duration. I think it was 235/ 239 as it is a duel pattern cam. It is designed as a copy of the RA IV cam with a few tweaks being a duel pattern cam. I know by todays std. thats not a lot of lift but even with the Alum. heads which are designed like the round port RA IV heads it runs very good. By the way it went 12:90's not 12:70's , But they seem to work good with this cam on the 400 + .60 over. With these heads on the engine when it was a 455 + .30 or the 462, it went 11:77 at 122 mph. That was with street radials 3:73 rear gears M22 4 spd. & RA IV exhaust manifolds. Thats why I don't see just going to a .60 over 455 should be much difference. Comp. is at 10.1 on the 400, & I don't know but should be close to that on the 455/469. Am I wrong in thinking that ? I'm not trying to get every last HP out of it as this is a street car 99% of the time, & mat see the track 1 or 2 times just to see how fast it really is. Ideas ? Comments ? Help ? I have spent a good deal of money on the bottom end so I don't have problems with that because I don't want it to come apart if I do get down on it hard. I do drive it like it is ment to be driven, after all it is a GTO.
122mph?
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Old 07-06-17, 12:07PM   #14
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Somtin aint right.
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Old 07-08-17, 02:44AM   #15
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The reason the speed is higher then it should be is that the car spins a lot at the start , & thats kinda the way I like it as I don't break a bunch of parts which is why I keep the street radials on it. It may spin some but I don't break a driveshaft & U-joints & trans parts & a bunch of other parts by letting it be taken up in the tires by letting them spin. But it makes up the time in 2nd & 3rd gear & then pounds away in 4th. The car weighs 3640 & with me in it well there another 230 to carry it down the track. So maybe now your slide rule will figure correctly. Also tjs44 the amount of HP I'd like to have is very doable in the amount of 550-575 (way on the top end) but doable with the set up I have now with the correct tune & without spending a bunch more money. 550 is a very real goal to get to with this set up with maybe a different cam choice & without going to a roller lifter set up.
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