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Old 05-27-04, 11:56AM   #1
Pontiac Dude
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Default Results and Info on a Daily driven Pump Gas ATI ProCharger unit

I know it's long (& have this info on our website also) but thought that someone might be interested in the.....

Complete Follow thru on the Progress of Fabricating and Installing the P1SC/D1SC ATI Centrifugal Supercharger for Blow thru Application on Pure Pontiacs:

Date: 4/01/04:
Finally got all the issues worked out and installing the complete ATI ProCharger self contained P1SC unit this weekend in Karen's 79 Daily Driver 455 79 T/A.

The complete P1SC setup/kit sells for $3695.00.
The complete D1SC kit sells for $3995.00 and will fit the same bracketry.

The following parts included:
ATI head unit, low profile hat, gasket, fittings, connector elbow, hoses, blow off valve, Pontiac (in house made) lower 8 rib pulley, custom offset spacers, bolts, custom ProCharger shaft (in house made) pulley, bracket, idler pulley w/ bolt style tensioner (no pry bar needed, lol), 8 rib (parts house available) belt, rear head mount bracket support w/adjustable tie rod, etc. Everything you need to install the basic unit. More then most kits have for the same or higher price.

Then all that is needed is a modified carb (we can build), MSD 6BTM or the MSD universal boost controller, Boost gauge, Fuel gauge, and a good fuel pump that will supply 'at least' 120 gpm, depend on application.

I recommend around 8.5-1/9.5-1 compression and still run pump gas, with 8/10 lbs of boost at 5600/6000 rpm. Will be doing testing in the next week with Karen's 455 79 T/A daily driver. Check our website in the left hand column for specs and future progress with pics. Should be track testing within 3 weeks.
Want to do basic street load, geometry, etc issues for a week with Karen driving it back and forth to work.

You can see the basic package, with pics and info on her car, under Lady Dude's 79 T/A, and we will be updating that info as we get results.

Expected goals from using the previous smaller ProCharger I ran in the mid 90's should take Karen's T/A from 13 flats into the mid 11's on 87 octane and "no" chassis mods except slapper bars. Where else can ya drive anywhere and have a good gas mileage car and run into the 11's on 87 octane.
What you want and how much hp with your current combo determines blower and pulley size.
We take payments, checks, cash, M/C or Visa. So, don't let the price bother ya. We're like Sears, we have lay-away.

All looks great, but want to make sure there are no unforeseen bugs, and will be sending already pre-order ProChargers out in 3 weeks. Thanks for your patience, but always try for quality first before it leaves the shop.

Check the website as I have updated all the info under ATI ProCharger in the left hand column

UpDate 4/05/04:
Got it all installed Friday on Karen's 79 T/A and made the Dude Scoop mount Saturday. It fits all under the hood with about a 1/2" to spare under the flat part of the hood with a Performer intake and Holley carb.
In future pics you will see that I even left the scoop mounted and pull the hat and bowls to make adjustments. Cool !!!
Had issues with the MSD retard box and Karen is currently driving it back and forth to work with a stock type distributor. Didn't have time to pull the mechanical fuel pump and install a vacuum tube to the manifold to reference the added fuel required. Plus the blow off valves didn't get here in time
Looks like I got the pulley set up close as at 60 mph and 3000 rpm it is making 4lbs of boost which should put it around 8/10 @ 5000 or so. Remember that this is an 8.5-1 compression lower rpm combo. Going to try to have the retard and fuel issues worked out in the next two weeks then head to the track to see the difference and compare results.

Trying to make this a daily driver with no noisy fuel pump, LOL, and pick up at least 1.2 seconds with a P1SC unit. Plus, it looks stock in the car and outwardly. Under the hood will be void of boxes and exotic fuel system. A real street sleeper. LOL. The gauges are mounted in the Dude scoop as the higher opening really works out.
Everything works great, no surge, no mis-alignment & plenty of clearance. Fits the same in the car as it did on the stand. Even have a flex fan installed without an electric fan. Runs 160 down the road.
I haven't driven it yet (without the retard and blow off, I'm afraid to drive it as it's hard for me to keep my foot out of it, LOL), but Karen says she can feel the power difference in the accelerator and can't stand on it yet. If she can tell, I know it's gonna fly.

Should be ready to send the units out by the end or beginning of the next month. May/beginning of June. Now ready to mass-produce all the parts. Have quite a few pending orders.

Got Install Pics on our website:

http://www.angelfire.com/fl4/pontiacdude428/ati.html

Still got a lot more to do, but she's been driving it all week to work. Just the 4/5 lbs of boost at 3000 rpm is killer. Taking mileage readings too. Karen says so far it seems to be getting better gas mileage then when it was Naturally Asperiated!!!!

Also have the ‘Dude Scoop’ mounted in a way that I don't have to take it off to remove the carb hat or fuel bowls. Plus, I put the Scoop on wing nuts if I have to take it off.
Another added benefit is that with the gauges (Auto Meter 2 5/8") mounted in the larger scoop opening, hot air can escape out each side.

Have to install the tubing in the mechanical fuel pump to reference the boost.
Ignition work as the MSD box failed and currently driving around on full tilt timing.

More as I get it done.

Question:
Everything looks nice under the hood. Could you have installed the victor manifold and a taller hat and still clear?
Answer:
No, as it's a tight fit even with a Torker I just installed and the stock type T/A scoop.
I ran a Warrior intake on my 76 T/A, but it has a snorkel type scoop. Pics of that are on the website.

Footnote:
Haven't had time to try out the new B.G. 220HR fuel system, but will have her car at the ‘Pontiacs in the Park’ race in Virginia.

Another UpDate 5/16/04:

Ok finally got more info after the Pontiacs in the Park weekend in Virginia.

Tried to get the BR220HR to work, by trying to cheat the return system. Wouldn't work. Ran a new #10 line from the bottom of the tank to the pump, then 1/2" from the pump to the BG return regulator. Then tried to use the original 5/16" line that ran from the canister back to the tank. My bad. To much resistance and wouldn't come down off 18 lbs at idle. Overloaded the carb, surging, etc.

Made some 13.80 with 86 mph and worse passes. Just laid down with black smoke and dying in the upper gears.
So, I tried different stuff for 2 days and finally just installed a spare Holley blue pump with the Moroso 19lb spring. Borrowed a regulator from Bob Cobb of Renegade Racing. Drilled the Holley regulator to install a tube to reference the pressure.
"Worked Great!!!!!!"

First pass the regulator was set at 9 lbs going to 18 lbs on boost to be safe. 12.80 ET, Good, Black smoke on the leave, but didn't lay down. Pulled to 109 mph. Made 6/7lbs of boost at 5000 rpm. Great!!!! Heading in the right direction.
Then I lowered the initial fuel pressure to 7 lbs going to 15 lbs and raise the shift point to 5200 from the engine only passes at 4800. which it liked. Trying to keep this fairly mild combination in the power band.
Next pass 12.33@111. OK, Now we're cookin. Still fat but workable.
End of the day so I couldn't do any more. Spent Friday and Saturday just trying to get a fuel issue worked out.

Sunday's here and really didn't want to make any changes as it was "Bracket time" and Karen was hitting some killer .009 and .016 lights.
They gave us two time runs on Sunday morning so we decide to just leave it alone.
First pass of the day............. 12.36 at 11.93
Second pass........................ 12.36 at 11.97
WOW consistent. If she hit her lights and ran those #'s all day. The money was her's.
So, we dialed a 12.36 and let Karen do her thing.
It was getting ready to rain and cooled a bit. It was actually hotter there then back home here in Florida. Rain delay for about 20 minutes then go. I shoulda dialed it down as I saw others breaking out, but not knowing how the Supercharger was gonna re-act. I decided to just let Karen do her thing.
The other dude red lighted and she ran it out the back door to see what it would to for next pass.
12.30 FLAT@ 111.95 and still muggy. but the temps dropped. Talked to Jack Gaydosh and he said the air was about 1800/2000 ft above sea level.
Anyway, it's there. Her car would have run in the 13.30 range there on motor. A full second increase with now the basic set up in place.

Ok So here's the package. I KNOW there is 11.90's in her combo which would make it act like a 250shot on Spray. As it is and needing more tuning.... it's like running like a 150/175 shot of Nitrous!!!! But with No bottle pressure to worry about. No re-fills, no solenoid issues, etc.

Anyway here ya go.

This has the original T-350 tranny and "Stock" converter. Another tenth or two is possible with a 2200/2400 holeshot converter.
This is also the BASE ATI ProCharger P1SC unit making only 6/7 lbs of boost at "5200" rpms with Karen’s combo.
More rpm, more boost. But, the cam won't go that far. LOL. It's a 212/225@.050 with .450 lift. A 068 Pontiac cam copy. Idles at 600 in gear with 8.5-1 compression on 87 octane driven every day.
So I feel the pulley set up is worked out to make over 10 lbs at 5800 or so in a modified engine.
We retained the K & N air filter over the passenger side headers. Install a cold air system would be worth 2 seconds or possibly more
Had 1 3/4 degrees of timing pulled out for every lb of boost with 89 octane. To be safe. More playing with 92 for track testing or racing, I feel no timing would need to be pulled (And pick up more ET) or.......... go back to 87 octane and run the same #'s?
This car has no trick suspension work. Stock all the way thru. Just a set of Slapper bars to try to control any wheel hop. Weighs 3700lbs with fuel and the additional Supercharger with brackets.
So with a Street/Strip car, more engine, better chassis....mid to low 11's are possible with this basic unit. And with the D1SC.......... constant low 11's, maybe 10's???

Update 5/23/04:
Next weekend. We decide to go to Bradenton on Sunday for their once a month all day Test & Tune. Have to see what if will do in Florida weather. LOL.
Took the Air Cleaner off and installed a 180 degree bend to pull cooler air from the front of the car. Extended the blow off tube so it didn't push warm air at the filter and blow it out the side T/A fender vent.
Well......... as Karen left the line black smoke just rolled like I never saw before and she said it just laid over and shuttered, so she lifted and brought it back to the trailer.
I lifted the hood and the bottom pulley was wobbling so bad I thought it was gonna come off. If it wasn't that the fan and blower belt were in line it would have unloaded
So we loaded up and came home.
Just pulled the balancer. Half the neck is gone.
Will try to get pics downloaded.
Somewhere in the bottom of the pan is having the balancer neck. Looks like the balancer split right up the keyway.
Installed another stock new type balancer and back running. Not gonna worry about where that piece is.
I now highly recommend using an SFI balancer!!!!
With Pontiacs, using a slide fit balancer. More strain is developed on the balancer when loading the ATI ProCharger belt.
Anyway, Pulled the unit and gonna install a D1SC unit on my 76 T/A.
The issues are worked out. I have the brackets ready to go. Karen's Belt looks awesome with no side wear or rib cuts after a month of driving and racing. Making pulleys as I post and will be selling and shipping out pre-sold units right after this Memorial Weekend.
Thanks for being patient for the people that sent deposits and hope they realize that, as with everything I do. I cut "NO" corners and don't want any future issues.

Now on to Phase 2; My 76 Pontiac Trans Am. Darth Vader, LOL:
I will start another topic on that car by itself. Putting the Black 76 T/A back on the street with a ‘Big’ Hydraulic Roller & Pump gas. A D1SC ATI ProCharger after I get the most I can on motor.
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Old 05-27-04, 12:34PM   #2
Reed '75_T/A
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Cool stuff Dude!!!! Keep us updated! :ax
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Old 05-28-04, 12:45AM   #3
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Now, this is what you call real testing, I'm excited. One
full second on a complete stock set up, and no bottle
to refill, I'm listening, now on to the bigger unit, and
lets see how many pony's this baby makes.

Dude I got to hand it to you, a complete set up, brackets
and all, dail in instructions, just doesn't get any better then
that. Keep us up dated, man this would save guys a ton
of money.
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Old 05-28-04, 02:05AM   #4
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Quote:
Now on to Phase 2; My 76 Pontiac Trans Am. Darth Vader, LOL:
I will start another topic on that car by itself. Putting the Black 76 T/A back on the street with a ‘Big’ Hydraulic Roller & Pump gas. A D1SC ATI ProCharger after I get the most I can on motor.
Now you got my attention.
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Old 02-22-09, 06:47PM   #5
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Default Pulley size?

Hey Pontiac Dude,
What size 8 rib pulley are you running on that unit?
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