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Old 01-12-18, 03:49AM   #46
Dragncar
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LS in old Pontiacs suck monkey balls.
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Old 01-12-18, 03:53AM   #47
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Cam beater, or I should say cam and lifter beater. To make 900 hp pump gas deal, thatís going to be street driven, your talking a minimum of .869 lift cam, big lobe .460. Valve springs are going to need 350 seat 800-850 open persure, and you better have bushed lifters, regular roll bearings lifters are not going to cut it. If you plan on putting allot of street miles on it 500-800-miles.

My buddy with the Shefferoff BBC making 750 hp is on his third cam and lifters.
Heís only 280 seat and 780 open the cam only 739 lift. Itís been 10.80ís but he puts allot of street miles on it ( not sure but Iíd guess) 500-600 miles a year. Heís not a racer and goes to the track maybe once a year.

A Turbo needs allot less cam, allot less head, maybe $650.00 for cam and lifters .650 lift tops. Jesel bushed lifters are like $1200.1400.00.

When you want to make serious power just turn that boost nob up.

A 900 hp N/A motor is like 10 mike per gal, lucky if you can pass a gas station. A Turbo deal 15-20 mpg.

900 hp pump gas race motor is all it is, itís not really street motor just because itíll run on pump gas. Just my opinion
Maybe, but 800 HP is doable with longevity.
BTW, all Jessels are needle bearing.
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Old 01-12-18, 10:02AM   #48
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gach, you made 880 right, with a .829 cam. 30 more ci and a better intake, 55mm should do it. How 'drivable" was the cam ?
The Jessel lifter you sold me a needle bearing. Langer says they are better than bushed. He broke Iskys best with ease. Over 1" cam too. He ran them for 3 years and they were good.
I dont think a .850ish cam will beat itself to death.
I should end up with a cam that makes between 800-850 HP with non aggressive ramps.
BTW, no plans on street miles with this engine.
See I don't get that. If you have no plans on street miles, why build a pump gas motor? Better off with big compression and race gas and take the extra h.p. if it is just a race car.
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Old 01-12-18, 11:09AM   #49
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Most I ever drove it on the street was around a couple of blocks. 4Ē exhaust thing was pretty loud. About 10 mile per gal...lol if you put your foot into it you could hear it for blocks. Problem was to cops live within those two blocks 9.30ís with right gear and convertor definitely 9.00 to 8.90.

How streetable is up to the individual, with that convertor I couldnít get it out of second gear..lol with out having to stop and down shift. Definitely a bad mother. But whoís going to race you. All spots we used to race is now all populated with houses.
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Old 01-12-18, 06:58PM   #50
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See I don't get that. If you have no plans on street miles, why build a pump gas motor? Better off with big compression and race gas and take the extra h.p. if it is just a race car.
IMO, race gas is for class racers. I bracket race. Now, 800HP is not hard at all with pump gas. That is more than enough to let me run Pro at 10 flat, quickest car in class, dominate it and still run Super Pro.2 classes at the same time.
I have done it for years with a 11 flat car, 42+ 1sts and 2nds.
I see no reason, NONE to run 8-10$ a gallon race gas to bracket race. Have to worry about blowing head gaskets ect.
3$ a gallon for a lot of fun. Then there is the look on their faces when you blow the doors off their chevy with a pump gas Pontiac.
I think all the people who just bracket race and run 16-1 CR are well, nice way of saying it is uneducated. Or have cash to set on fire.
Besides, high CR does not make "that" much more power.
Race gas, 3-5 times the cost 10-15% more power.
Pump gas drag racing is a great bang for the buck. I just plan on doing it at a higher level than some.
And I can retire the engine some day from racing and simply re cam and valve spring it and drive it many miles on the street at the 70 year old guy with the cool 69 GTO.
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Old 01-12-18, 08:13PM   #51
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LS in old Pontiacs suck monkey balls.
Not in an old Mazda they don't
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Old 01-12-18, 10:25PM   #52
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It depends on what your into, if your a bracket racer or a street strip type guy. Did my share of class and bracket racing. Loading up every Sunday to go bracket Racing was allot of fun, when the track was only a hour away.

Christ when I class race my 68 Goat, I used to drive it to the track, beat up on the Fords, Mopars and Chevy’s tons of trophies. That was the best time.

Today to drove 3.5-4.00 hours one way to go bracket Racing just isn’t fun, and has become unaffordable.

Maybe because I’m older, me I just want to have the power. And be respect/feared by the locals, something a Pontiac wasn’t able to do for years.

It’s all about what you have for competition in your area whether or not you can kick their butt, with yes a Pontiac that won’t rev past 5500 rpms LOL
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Old 01-12-18, 10:28PM   #53
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I turboed my car for around $4,000. That is cam and all. I got lucky by buying some stuff like the carb, hat, and ignition box used from my buddies. I did all the work myself too, but anyone should be able to do the same thing. I've ran it through the 1/4 one time [ normally run the 1/8th ]. It wasn't a perfect pass as I couldn't leave on boost. It ran 9.46 at almost 146mph at around 3,800lbs on 7.5-8psi. It's non-intercooled and runs on pump gas and a little water/methanol. I've had it to 12psi, but not at the track yet. It should run atleast 150mph on 12psi and pump gas.
It would be pretty tough for someone to build an na engine to run like this on pump gas and be able to drive it every day if you wanted to. An engine like this would probably be much bigger and have more in the valve train than my entire turbo build. Then once you do get it built and wanted another 50hp it's gonna cost you $2,000 and drop you a tenth and a half at the track. With a turbo car it is just two clicks to the right. I still like na cars, but there is no comparison in power production and driveability.
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Old 01-12-18, 10:58PM   #54
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Maybe because Iím older, me I just want to have the power. And be respect/feared by the locals, something a Pontiac wasnít able to do for years.

Itís all about what you have for competition in your area whether or not you can kick their butt, with yes a Pontiac that wonít rev past 5500 rpms LOL
It,s like what You and JSPONT says. Everytime I'm out in my car people run over at the gas stations, talk to me at lights, and just stand and stare when I drive away from the track. A turbo Pontiac is a unicorn around here. I am proud to do it with a Pontiac. And, to your point, the fastest guy in our group right now has to trailer his car everywhere. He's only a tenth faster than me right now and he's 1,000lbs lighter and on spray with a BES 408" LS. I had a problem and couldn't turn my stuff up before the track closed. The turbo gives me the ability to make power AND drive it wherever.
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Old 01-12-18, 11:16PM   #55
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Well, my old pump gas combo was really streetable, what I consider a little roller 264/274 @ 739 lift definitely would run 9.50ís all day long. My car not that light either 3360# made 761 hp.

The top end for that combo was $6500.00, including carb. Cam, heads and intake.

Top end I just sold ( a year ago ) was around $8000.00 used of cruse. Definitely wouldíve got a 9.00 out of it.

But it all comes down to what your going to do with the car. For me no longer having the desire to bracket race.
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Old 01-12-18, 11:20PM   #56
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It,s like what You and JSPONT says. Everytime I'm out in my car people run over at the gas stations, talk to me at lights, and just stand and stare when I drive away from the track. A turbo Pontiac is a unicorn around here. I am proud to do it with a Pontiac. And, to your point, the fastest guy in our group right now has to trailer his car everywhere. He's only a tenth faster than me right now and he's 1,000lbs lighter and on spray with a BES 408" LS. I had a problem and couldn't turn my stuff up before the track closed. The turbo gives me the ability to make power AND drive it wherever.
Thatís what itís all about ! Love it
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Old 01-12-18, 11:29PM   #57
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I built the old combo around 2008-2009, wish the knowledge or availability was around then, knowing what I know now, definitely would be running a Turbo.

So much more affordable and Dial in or should I say turn it up a notch. Specially when I see what Big Chief doing.
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Old 01-13-18, 12:41AM   #58
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Yup I did all the work myself and went blow thru. I have less than 4G's into it.
Pump gas 800 h.p. on the street you have to control it with computers/timing/ throttle stop....
I take my 1000h.p. 15 psi turn the boost down to 6 psi and have 600 h.p. so it is easy to control on the street.
When street driving I Have a 575 lift cam with 8.75 compression, it drive like a ????? cat. Sunday mornings I drive to a crazy car show 50 miles each way, no problem. Kids soccer games,practice and supermarket runs.
Charlie66 sent me a video of his 4 cyl turbo spanking a new Z06 (it was not stock either).
My bucket list is drag week, I know the car can do it, not sure I can!
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Old 01-13-18, 02:13AM   #59
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Yup I did all the work myself and went blow thru. I have less than 4G's into it.
Pump gas 800 h.p. on the street you have to control it with computers/timing/ throttle stop....
I take my 1000h.p. 15 psi turn the boost down to 6 psi and have 600 h.p. so it is easy to control on the street.
When street driving I Have a 575 lift cam with 8.75 compression, it drive like a ????? cat. Sunday mornings I drive to a crazy car show 50 miles each way, no problem. Kids soccer games,practice and supermarket runs.
Charlie66 sent me a video of his 4 cyl turbo spanking a new Z06 (it was not stock either).
My bucket list is drag week, I know the car can do it, not sure I can!
Ź06 before I had my converter tightened last time. Don't know what was done to it. Let out before the 1/8th on this one.

https://youtu.be/xGoeZAtrUUo
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Old 01-13-18, 10:35AM   #60
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Ź06 before I had my converter tightened last time. Don't know what was done to it. Let out before the 1/8th on this one.

https://youtu.be/xGoeZAtrUUo
Nice!!! Charlie66 was moving about 50 mph, the Z06 left 1st, At about 100 mph he walked him like the guy let off!!!
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