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Old 05-21-13, 11:39PM   #61
Glenn Lever
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Went testing Friday, and ran the gasser series race on Saturday; This is after fixing the leaking head gasket on the right side (this time) and bolting the brand new Littlefield standard 8/71 blower on. I first ran a tank of fuel through it to take some of the tightness out of the blower, it still has a ways to go to be broken in, I still have not gotten the shift light working. The bulb is ok, the connections seem Ok, I think the MSD RPM switch is broke. Here is a summery

Get closer to the 8.500 index

First run, Friday night 6:10 PM
Air Density 1640
Top Pulley 58
Pill 75
Fuel Pressure 82.11
Top end Boost 10.13
Sift to second gear 6479
60 foot 1.316
mile 8.698 155.68
Comments, This is the first run with the new blower. This is slower than with the old carb. setup, need to do some work here.

Second Run, Friday night 7:08 PM
Air Density 1512
Top Pulley 54
Pill 75
Fuel Pressure 79.62
Top end Boost 11.94
Sift to second gear 6407
60 foot 1.226
mile 8.254 158.89
Comments, Pumped more air into the engine, leaned it out. This is really unusually good air. This was a very smooth run, when I got out at the top end I thought I had run a slower run than the last one. Engine really liked this set up, but it is too fast for the 8.5 we are looking for.

Third Run, Friday night 8:04 PM
Air Density 1529
Top pulley 56
Pill 75
Fuel Pressure 80.27
Top end Boost 10.65
Sift to second gear 6481
60 foot 1.253
mile 8.469 157.42
Comment, Good comparison run (air quality). Took a little air away (fattened up a little to make it go slower. Still too fast. Engine struggled a little to get to the shift point. Really pulled hard after the shift. Accelerometer went from .57 to 1.14


Fourth Run, Friday night 9:04 PM
Air Density 1119
Top pulley 57
Pill 80
Fuel Pressure 77.42
Top end Boost 10.65
Sift to second gear 6494
60 foot 1.248
mile 8.483 157.42
Comment, Air quality jumped up. Took a little air away (fattened up a little to make it go slower), took some fuel away to try and keep the air fuel ratio close. Still just a touch to fast, but close. Engine did not like this, felt rough.

Ok, now Saturday, Gasser series racing, You have to remember I have only been running the dragster three years now and each year I have made significant changes to the engine so data from one year is not good for data for the next year (don’t laugh).
Gasser series is 1/8 mile ET racing, so I have no mile times (so for comparison a mile 8.483 is an 1/8 mile 5.427)

First round of qualifying, Saturday 1:44 PM
Air Density 1896
Top pulley 57
Pill 80
Fuel Pressure 74.19
Top end Boost 10.84
Sift to second gear 6568
60 foot 1.270
1/8 mile 5.301 134.87
Comment, Air quality is closer to normal for around here. Decided to make no changes between last run last night and this run. Track prep may not have been as good and I had some wheel spin of the line. There was a sharp peak in engine RPM right before the shift to second, in .05 seconds the engine RPM jumped 156 RPM. The air would have had the effect of fattening it up. Ran to fast for a mile 8.5

Second round of qualifying, Saturday 2:49 PM
Air Density 2007
Top pulley 59
Pill 85
Fuel Pressure 66.36
Top end Boost 9.02
Sift to second gear 6487
60 foot 1.277
1/8 mile 5.364 132.27
Comment, Air quality still falling. Took some more fuel and air away. Still too fast, but going in the right direction. Felt pretty good.

Third round of qualifying, Saturday 4:15 PM
Air Density 2262
Top pulley 60
Pill 90
Fuel Pressure 57.83
Top end Boost 8.43
Sift to second gear 6434
60 foot 1.283
1/8 mile 5.368 134.42
Comment, Air quality still falling. Took some more fuel and air away. Fuel pressure as well as boost is falling off pretty good now. Still too fast, but going in the right direction. Felt pretty good.

Ok, now we are into the first round of elimination so we decided not to play with it and see if we could predict an ET.
First round of eliminations, Saturday 6:10 PM
Air Density 2270
Top pulley 60
Pill 90
Fuel Pressure 59.59
Top end Boost 9.09
Sift to second gear 6200
60 foot 1.276
1/8 mile 5.378 131.88
Comment, I short shifted by 200 RPM so my ET was down. I treed the guy though so won the race by .1144 seconds.

Second round of eliminations, Saturday 7:34 PM
Air Density 1842
Top pulley 60
Pill 90
Fuel Pressure 64.85
Top end Boost 8.76
Sift to second gear 6343
60 foot 1.274
1/8 mile 5.391 132.15
Comment, Air got better. We were concussed by this run, it was almost identical in shift points, launch, etc as the last run but lost .020 on the run. It finally dawned on us that the blower was still new and still losing up. Over laid the two run graphs and low and behold boost at the shift on run 4 was 8.05 and on the last run 7.91. In almost all other respects the graphs from the two runs over laid themselves. I treed the guy again but it was not enough to overcome his dial in of 6.22 when he ran a 6.221. I lost by .0197 seconds.
Not a bad outing for my first race with a blower and mechanical fuel injection, I’m happy, cannot wait till the next outing. I can’t go this weekend as my better half, crew chief will be out of town.
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Old 06-07-13, 06:15PM   #62
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So after 40 days and 40 nights of rain and cold weather it looks like we might get to go to the track tomorrow. The dragster has been wanting to quit running at the top end of the track (fuel running away from the pick up) so I have been wanting to install a primer system



I purchased a "Kit" that used Enderle's billet tank through AlkyDigger



To do what I want which is a little out of the box I had to purchase some additional stuff

]

So this install made me really nervous as it just seemed to fall together, normally you have to fight and fit things many times but this just seemed to go together. The return from the "K" valve was just the right height of the bottom of the belly pan



I removed the two plugs from the side of the primer tank and two -8 fittings screwed right in, I removed the straight 1/8 NPT to -4 fitting out of the bottom and installed a 1/8 NPT 90 -4 fitting on the bottom. On the -8 fitting I installed a -8 coupler.

So the tank is just the right height so that the bottom fitting just sits on the belly pan, the -8 return on the tank is just the right distance from the side of the chassis and bottom of the belly pan. The wiring from the old electric fuel pump was in just the right location to connect the primmer pump. With it plumbed into the return line from the "K" valve the tank will always be full once started for the first time on a race day. That just makes one less thing that needs to be done in the pit.



I replaced the old fuel pump toggle switch with the rubber capped momentary on starter button ordered from Summit, and now at a push of a button I get a nice squirt of alcohol into the rear most port of the hat on top of the blower. I had used the rear ports in the blower for my rear two injectors. We will try it out tomorrow.

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Old 07-04-13, 03:26PM   #63
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Well it has been awhile since I actually posted anything on the dragster.

Well it has been raining, raining, raining, and more rain.

I did get out two weeks ago and really hope to get out again tomorrow to do some more testing, but it looks like rain.

It is really important to get out tomorrow as I want to go to Norwalk the 20th for an NDRL race. The problem is that, one it is an index race and I have not gotten that squared away, two it is a pro tree and have had no practice on a pro tree, I may go anyway to get away from this RAIN (and yes I am tempted to use a forbidden word here), and three it is mile and lately for one reason or another it seems all my racing has been 1/8 mile, I hate 1/8 mile.

Went club racing Friday June 21 club racing 1/8 mile. Here is a summery

First run, Friday night 8:23 PM
Air Density 2200
Top Pulley 60
Pill 90
Fuel Pressure 60.38
Top end Boost 9.02
60 foot 1.316
Calculated mile 8.443
A/F ratio 3.808
Comments, I did not write down the pulley size and pill so this was done from memory, data is questionable.

Second Run, Friday night 9:22 PM
Air Density 1810
Top Pulley 62
Pill 90
Fuel Pressure 59.82
Top end Boost 8.31
60 foot 1.303
Calculated mile 8.586
A/F ratio 3.810
Comments, This is really unusually good air. Took away some air, but the density go better the end result was little change

Third Run, Friday night 10:15 PM
Comment, I had to throw this run out (won the race), dew had fallen and after the 1/8 mile marker I had to get out of it as it got really squirrely (rear tires started to spin in the dew on the track). Data was all screwed up and graph was useless.



Ok, now Saturday, Gasser series racing, June 22.
Gasser series is 1/8 mile ET racing, so I have no mile times (so for comparison a mile 8.483 is a 1/8 mile 5.427). We only had two time trails as there was a bad accident that shut the track down for awhile, the guy is ok?, but will be in the hospital for awhile.

First round of qualifying, Saturday 3:07 PM
Air Density 3079
Top pulley 62
Pill 95
Fuel Pressure 51.61
Top end Boost 7.53
60 foot 1.312
Cal 1/4 mile 8.702
AF Ratio 3.688
Comment, Felt terrible, to slow for the 8.5, fuel out the pipes, need to make big changes

Second round of qualifying, Saturday 4:35 PM
Air Density 3249
Top pulley 60
Pill 105
Fuel Pressure 52.06
Top end Boost 8.31
60 foot 1.265
Cal 1/4 mile 8.392
AF Ratio 4.074
Comment, Much more like it, but now too fast. This run was against my arched nemesis (a good friend who in the second round of eliminations I give the race away to by breaking out and red lighting). I had my best light ever a .508 and beat his ET by .1865, now if only I could do that in a race.

Ok, now we are into the first round of elimination so we decided not to play with it and see if we could predict an ET.
First round of eliminations, Saturday 6:13 PM
Air Density 3100
Top pulley 60
Pill 105
Fuel Pressure 50.99
Top end Boost 8.24
60 foot 1.247
Cal 1/4 mile 8.410
A/F Ratio 4.072
Comment, Treed him and won by .0281.

Second round of eliminations, Saturday 7:41 PM
Air Density 2858
Top pulley 60
Pill 105
Fuel Pressure 53.28
Top end Boost 8.31
60 foot 1.241
Cal 1/4 mile 8.355
AF Ratio 4.110

Comments. This guy and I end up racing each other a lot as are ETs are always close. We have yet to have a race, we each keep giving the race to the other one, this time I red lite and broke out. The dragster sounded good and felt good, it likes this air fuel ratio better, but once again I am too fast for the 8.5 index.

Serious consideration is being given to going in the other direction (8.000 index). The problem boils down to engine RPM. I am concerned that this engine will not last if I push the RPM higher, currently turning 6400s at the top end. This is a stroked Pontiac 400 punched and stroked out to 461. A simple fix would be to put a higher tire on the rear. I am currently running a 31X13X15 M/T. by going to a 32 high tire I increase the circumference by 3.96 percent (drop the top end RPM by 253)(circumference 97.0 to 101). No one makes a 32X13X15 tire Hoosier has a 13.5X13.5X15 in a lightweight C07 compound, but the side wall will not clear and I cannot space it out as the tire rim combo I have now is spaced out, so I would have to buy rims also. Hoosier also makes a 32.0X13.0X15 in a D05 compound which is a soft compound and one of the problems is I have low HP and based on the graphs I am dead hooking now. M/T makes a 33X10.5X15 tire with a M3 compound (medium). This tire is interesting in that the compound is a little harder, the with is smaller so it might help with the launch, but I afraid that I do not have the HP to turn a 2 inch taller tire. INPUT REQUESTED

Tuning, it I stay with the 8.5 I think I want to try a 110 pill and adjust pulleys to get an A/F ratio of 4.1. By taking away more fuel and keeping the A/F ratio about the same I should take away HP and slow it down a little more. Sure would like to go to the 8.000, but have the RPM / tire problem.
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Old 07-07-13, 07:11PM   #64
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Well we really wanted to test this weekend as I would like to go to Norwalk for NDRL

Briggs and Stratton Summer Jam
at the Blue Suede Cruise
Summit Motorsports Park
Norwalk, OH

http://www.frontenginedragsters.org/...php?topic=48.0
http://summitmotorsportspark.com/ind...4/-/-?Itemid=1

We still do not have the 8.5 index straightened away and kind have hit the physical limit of slowing down with air fuel mixture (top pulley cannot be any larger without changing the belt guard and the bottom pulley is a 42 tooth pulley and has the drive for the belt for the fuel pump inside).

We have made the adventurous decision to go for the 8.0 index instead.

Empire was rained out Friday, washed out Saturday, so we decided to drive two hours to go to Esta Safety Park Dragstrip‎, 8091 Eastwood Road, Cicero, NY 13039. Got up at 5 in the morning to leave by 6 (two hour drive), got within 10 minutes of it and received it was closed due to flooding.

Plans now are to blow off club racing July 12th for testing for Norwalk.
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Old 07-17-13, 12:51AM   #65
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Glen,

This thread is the absolut best. The last time I read this was before you had it to the track. Eventually I want a blower for my altered. It looks like I'm going to start building the foundation for that this winter so this is going to be very helpful for that. Last time out for my car I ran it too hot and now it sounds like it has a rod knock and there's a lot of copper flakes in the oil filter. I still need to pull the pan off, but it sees like the crank is going to probably look like the one you've pulled out of your firebird on your website. If that's the case, I'm going to start building a 400 block, thinking of 4.21 stoke, forged crank, and probably steel c&a rods since I'm already using them in my current engine. Are you running a 4.0 or a 4.21 stroke? Also do you have the block filled to the bottom of the coolant holes? I've been talking to paul spott and the dirtction to go on this.

Lots of good info here, good luck!
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Old 07-17-13, 01:54AM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scavo1 View Post
Glen,

This thread is the absolut best. The last time I read this was before you had it to the track. Eventually I want a blower for my altered. It looks like I'm going to start building the foundation for that this winter so this is going to be very helpful for that. Last time out for my car I ran it too hot and now it sounds like it has a rod knock and there's a lot of copper flakes in the oil filter. I still need to pull the pan off, but it sees like the crank is going to probably look like the one you've pulled out of your firebird on your website. If that's the case, I'm going to start building a 400 block, thinking of 4.21 stoke, forged crank, and probably steel c&a rods since I'm already using them in my current engine. Are you running a 4.0 or a 4.21 stroke? Also do you have the block filled to the bottom of the coolant holes? I've been talking to paul spott and the dirtction to go on this.

Lots of good info here, good luck!
I'm sorry to hear about the copper in the fliter, that cnnot be good.

I have a 4.210 .45 over 461 displacement all wrong for a blower engine, you want less compression, shorter stroke, higher RPM. My next blower engine will be a 429 aluminum, The block is not filled at all, I'm not sure what I will have on the next one yet.

Paul has given me good advice in the past.

Good luck, do you have a thread on this?
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Old 07-17-13, 10:45AM   #67
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So how come you didn't go with the 4.0 stroke? It seems like in your earlier posts that was the direction you were going. What is the final compression ratio? What will be the bore/stroke of the 429? Forgive me if you've got all this info on your website, I haven't had a chance to ready through it all.
Do you know why the engine in the your red firebird failed the way it did?

Here is the small thread I started, Mr PBody pointed gave me some good pointers.

http://www.pontiaczone.com/forum/showthread.php?t=29200

Joe
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Old 07-17-13, 11:28AM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scavo1 View Post
So how come you didn't go with the 4.0 stroke? It seems like in your earlier posts that was the direction you were going. What is the final compression ratio? What will be the bore/stroke of the 429? Forgive me if you've got all this info on your website, I haven't had a chance to ready through it all.
Do you know why the engine in the your red firebird failed the way it did?

Here is the small thread I started, Mr PBody pointed gave me some good pointers.

http://www.pontiaczone.com/forum/showthread.php?t=29200

Joe
This engine was built as an normally aspirated engine for the Firebird. At the time I had no intentions of putting a blower on it. that is why it was bored and stroked.

This is for the new engine
Custom built Venolia pistons and aluminum rods.
Pistons: 4.155 Bore
.990 Pin/Supply Pins & Spiro Locks
2.200 intake notch/ 1.750 Exhaust notch
15cc Dish Includes Valve Notches
10.5 Comp. for Blown Alcohal
1.605 Compression Distance
Aluminum Rods:
Big Block Chevy Big End and Pin Bore
6.635 Center – Center
-.010 Aluminum
4.00 stroke

I believe the engine in the firebird failed due to lake of oil. I think the pan was being sucked dry (all the oil in the top end) I put a 7 quart pan on it and have not had a problem since.

Link to the thread?

Just a note I am the administrator to a forum that has a discussion for altereds. Most activity is in the Front Engine Dragster section. take a look
http://www.frontenginedragsters.org/forum/index.php
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Old 07-17-13, 12:05PM   #69
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Ok I see, I thought the current engine in the dragster is the one you’re talking about building in earlier posts. Well I hope you make it to Norwalk this weekend, that is my favorite track, been going there since the early 90's. I live in Chicago now so it’s hard to make it back there as often as I'd like. By the way, that dragster is absolutely beautiful.

The link I started was mainly for asking questions about converting to 4 bolt mains, trying to figure what the cost is going to be to build a new short block that will be able to be used for a future blower setup, by changing the pistons and camshaft.

http://www.pontiaczone.com/forum/showthread.php?t=29200

That's a pretty extensive forum; I've never seen one for just altereds!
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Old 07-27-13, 05:14PM   #70
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Hey Glenn I am switching to the 33x 10.5-15 MT Tire. Know alot of guys around here that run it with Great success. Would def. recommend trying it. you can play with tire pressure also on them. I used to run a 14.5x31-15. But want the ability to jump into some local 10.5 class racing once Im finally dialed in. Also going to tall tire to keep RPM down thru the traps and also possibly not have to swap rear gearing out atm.
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Old 08-11-13, 01:13AM   #71
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Well did some test and tune today to work on .400 Pro Tree and 8.50 index racing. Been working off and on on this for awhile now with not too much success. The vehicle has been too fast and I have been too slow.

The plan is to go to the NDRL race at Edgewater Sports Park Cleves, Ohio in two weeks. I have never run a pro tree and an index so this will all be new to me.

First run, Saturday 1:33 PM August 10
Air Density 2317
Top Pulley 63
Bottom Pulley 42
Pill 110
Top end Fuel Pressure 53.82
Top end Boost 6.74
Reaction time a perfect .400 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
60 foot 1.275
mile 8.467 / 159.23 MPH
A/F ratio 4.048
Comments, Seem dead off the launch, engine RPM graph was flat after launch, two peaks in g-force after launch, short shifted by 300 RPM to second gear

Second run, Saturday 3:11 PM August 10
Air Density 2413
Top Pulley 63
Bottom Pulley 42
Pill 113 Leaned it out a little
Top end Fuel Pressure 49.83
Top end Boost 6.94
Reaction time .423 not to bad
60 foot 1.275
mile 8.526 / 159.20 MPH
A/F ratio 4.152
Comments, Air was a little worse, and took a little fuel away, I hit the limiter for a brief second before the shift to second. Second good light on the pro tree, ET would be ok for a 8.500 index

Third run, Saturday 4:57 PM August 10
Air Density 2280
Top Pulley 63
Bottom Pulley 42
Pill 113 Leaned out a little
Top end Fuel Pressure 47.72
Top end Boost 7.07
Reaction time .389 Oops
60 foot 1.267
mile 8.451 / 162.27 MPH Fastest speed I have run yet, I have run faster ETs, but not speed
A/F ratio 4.175
Comments, By the time I ran after sitting in the staging lanes the air got better, was to fast again, Shift to second was right on

Forth run, Saturday 6:52 PM August 10
Air Density 2077
Top Pulley 64
Bottom Pulley 42
Pill 113 Leaned out a little
Top end Fuel Pressure 48.12
Top end Boost 6.68
Reaction time .394 two in a row
60 foot 1.272
mile 8.504 / 158.45 MPH I can live with this for a 8.500 index!!!!!!!!!!!
A/F ratio 4.138 This may be the magic number with the 113 bypass pill (adjust pulleys to get A/F Ratio)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!A touch fatter than the 8.526 run, slowed it down perfect.

A great day of testing, we are in the ball park!
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Old 09-23-13, 12:17AM   #72
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We went and did some test and tune today.

The symptom we have is the engine comes up to RPM on the trans brake, I release the trans brake and the dragster launches, and then falls on its face. It then pickss itself up and has a pretty normal run. I hit my shift point at 6300 RPM, RPMs drop off as you would expect and then climbs again.

What is pictured below and in the attached files (not sure which is easiest for you to view) is a graph produced in the data logger.

It appears to show a drastic drop in fuel pressure before the slump in engine RPM. The first graph shows the complete run. The second graph is just the area between the blue vertical lines to zoom in on the troubled area.



This is the zoom in on the trouble area.
When the engine RPM reaches 4756 the fuel pressure is at 31.92 pounds.
When the engine RPM reaches 4810 the fuel pressure has dropped to 3.37 pounds.
When the engine RPM drops to 3527 the fuel pressure recovered to 16.13 pounds and continues to climb.

The red vertical lines are for reference between the two graphs of fuel pressure and engine RPM.



If we lean the engine out (not changing the fuel main bypass, but add air by decreasing the top pulley the problem is not as pronounced. We are blowing fuel out the number 8 cylinder.

This graph represents an 8.904 ET run in the mile
We lean it out and ran an 8.409

We have check compression, valve lash, put in a new MSD box, New coil, removed the primmer, check timing, increased timing to 30 degrees, check the inside of the distributor cap, remove and cut open the torque converter (no problems found)
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Old 09-25-13, 11:13AM   #73
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Easy peasy.

This took maybe ten minutes. Coat hanger "U" clip around flapper, and spring clip at the top.

I am confident this will hold the flapper open for a trail.

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Old 10-24-13, 02:13AM   #74
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Truly a sad moment, the end of summer, the Jeep has its top and doors back on and ready for storage, and the dragster is in pieces.



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Glenn R. Lever
Rochester, New York 14617-2012
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Old 01-07-14, 05:02PM   #75
Glenn Lever
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Quickest run to date is 8.030 at 161

The engine in the dragster is apart,the crank needs to be ground, bearings need replacement.




A conservative estimate is there are 200 runs on these parts.

Plan is to now check every 50 runs.



There were never any shavings in the oil filter. It appears they were just hammered until they started to squeeze out the side and rub against the crank journal. The crank does need to be ground.



I could not get the shot I wanted of the cam. The one lobe has the start of a dish at the top. We will replace the cam with the same grind but with a more blower friendly lobe separation.



I still think they look nice. I believe the engine is developing about 850 HP, we will put it on the dyno when rebuilt



Full update with pictures on my web site.
http://www.leverfamilysite.com/2010_...14_01_06_E.htm
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