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Old 06-10-11, 11:37PM   #16
Gach
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You really think its that easy? If I gave you my heads, intake and cam do you think you could make 890hp with them on pump gas?
Why not, I mean out side of the carb, why couldn't I bolt them on my short block and make the same HP, We know the quality of the short block is important, good rings. Ring seal, as light as possible rotating assembly. I'd like to here your reasoning why.
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Old 06-11-11, 12:25AM   #17
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Why not, I mean out side of the carb, why couldn't I bolt them on my short block and make the same HP, We know the quality of the short block is important, good rings. Ring seal, as light as possible rotating assembly. I'd like to here your reasoning why.
For the same reason why some can run faster than others with less head, cam and engine. Skill of assembler and tuner make WORLD of difference.
There have been some post made by people with Tiger heads and intake that are struggling to make 900hp, why is that if it is just an easy bolt on 1050hp?
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Old 06-11-11, 12:28AM   #18
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Take Jim Hands wagon. Looks simple, sounds simple but how many people do you know with more head, cam and intake/carb and a lighter car can't run mid to low 11?
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Old 06-11-11, 01:32AM   #19
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Some very good points, Not many if any where able to duplicate Hand. I think though someone with experience could.
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Old 06-11-11, 02:06AM   #20
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Why not, I mean out side of the carb, why couldn't I bolt them on my short block and make the same HP, We know the quality of the short block is important, good rings. Ring seal, as light as possible rotating assembly. I'd like to here your reasoning why.
Will your CR be the same? If you are not running flat top pistons, will the domes be shaped the same as his domes? Will your headers have the same tube diameter and length also will the collectors have the same diameter and length as his? Is he running lower tension rings than you? Does he have an oil pan / windage system than saves more HP than your.

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Old 06-11-11, 09:45AM   #21
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think its very doable with todays parts and tech. Who's not to say a good tuner couldnt get more out of it even.. I read so many posts on Forums of guys that cant make a Pontiac run. And so many local expert shops that build their motors. Out of all the shops I've dealt with over the years. Out of say 50 machine shops All build a good motor. I bet only 5 can do a Pontiac correctly. They have their own way of running. Cant build them like a Chevy, Ford , or Dodge. Just like you cant build a Chevy and Dodge the same way.
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Old 06-11-11, 11:28AM   #22
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think its very doable with todays parts and tech. Who's not to say a good tuner couldnt get more out of it even.. I read so many posts on Forums of guys that cant make a Pontiac run. And so many local expert shops that build their motors. Out of all the shops I've dealt with over the years. Out of say 50 machine shops All build a good motor. I bet only 5 can do a Pontiac correctly. They have their own way of running. Cant build them like a Chevy, Ford , or Dodge. Just like you cant build a Chevy and Dodge the same way.
LOL totally disagree here. My head/intake guy isn't a Pontiac guy he ports all makes and probably has only ported 10 or so sets of Pontiac heads. My engine guy is a Ford man, the only Pontiacs he has built are mine and my dads. The fastest NA Pontiacs are NOT built by Pontiac guys. If your good your good and can make power with anything!
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Old 06-11-11, 03:03PM   #23
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EC, yes.
What are the other variables.
Build a good shortblock with like components and great ring seal. Step one.
Get the right carb. That might take some doing but it can be done.
Get headers as least as good as yours.
There is not a whole lot more to it.
Find the right timing.
Proper jetting and air bleeds.
Cam degreed in the same spot.

What do you think, this is some sort of NASA project.

In fact, I bet I could buy APs 450cfm Tigers, worked Tiger intake and a 535 shortblock built by Big Speed and make more than your 890.
Is there some reason I could not, assuming I had the dollars to spend on it.
If you took your heads and let someone digitize them someone else could make the same power as you. Your intake, as it was cut in half might be hard to duplicate with a 5 axis machine. I do not know. But I bet someone could make a repeatable CNC program for a BOP that would work at least as well.
I just do not know why you think is so hard or secretive to make power.
Its all about the induction system. And you can just buy them ready to make power.

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Old 06-11-11, 03:13PM   #24
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EC, yes.
LOL well there you have it, it is just that easy.
All short blocks are created equal, all tuners are equal, all machinist are equal, and all builders are equal. Hell not sure why everyone isn't making 1050hp. Can you answer that? Every Tiger headed engine out there should be making 1050 why aren't they? If all it takes is Tiger heads and intake and their spec'd cam these engines should be a dime a dozen.
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Old 06-11-11, 03:22PM   #25
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There are those that have done it and there are those who think they can. Two TOTALLY different things!
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Old 06-11-11, 05:23PM   #26
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If I was going after 890 HP on pump gas, there's only a few people out there who could do it. To pay that kind of money I'd go to the ones with proven track record. Definitely allot to it, but I would say an induction package from anyone of them is the way to go.
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Old 06-11-11, 05:30PM   #27
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The power is in the induction package,but some internet educated racer-engine builder will still manage to screw it up,the rest is Race engine builder 101.Bill C.
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Old 06-11-11, 05:49PM   #28
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BTR( Bill Trevato)Olds man, John Kaase, Ford man and BES (Tony Bischoff) Ford. They have all built some sick Pontiac power.
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Old 06-11-11, 06:00PM   #29
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The power is in the induction package,but some internet educated racer-engine builder will still manage to screw it up,the rest is Race engine builder 101.Bill C.
Exactly, your not going to bolt on a induction package with out dynoing the motor. Could I buy your package and make that kind of power, sure could, because number one it would be on the dyno and as you said I'd have to follow your instuctions. Which would include oil pan to carb, wall finish and ring package.
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Old 06-11-11, 07:40PM   #30
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There are some very gifted head guys out there that do understand how to make power. But seriously I think their a small bunch. The guys that have done my heads arnt Pontiac specific But understand the Difference between a Pontiac,Chevy and Fords needs. Most dont. Just wondering EC what combination you run and what kind of numbers you getting with Your head guy, If I may ask?? If you deal with most local speed shops and have them do your Pontiac Think you gonna fall short of its true Potential. As i said above but i do agree their is a few gifted head guys around that can make anything run..



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LOL totally disagree here. My head/intake guy isn't a Pontiac guy he ports all makes and probably has only ported 10 or so sets of Pontiac heads. My engine guy is a Ford man, the only Pontiacs he has built are mine and my dads. The fastest NA Pontiacs are NOT built by Pontiac guys. If your good your good and can make power with anything!

Last edited by bryan67gto : 06-11-11 at 07:42PM. Reason: finished thought
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